PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

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Mike Nike
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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Mike Nike » Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:38 pm

tse f1, f1sl, ptm and maybe even some gt series have been somewhat similar in terms of the effect, fuel+tyre consumption has on the optimal pit strategy.
i invested quite a lot of hours in theory and in driving a somewhat varianceless track (constant laptimes driveable) in order to somewhat prove my theories.
i cant remember for sure, but i probably even included variables, such as %accidents/crashs (influenced by warps in addition), pit mistakes, traffic, disconnections, which all might influence a little bit, if it comes to determing the optimal pit strategy.
i was able to calculate somewhat exact differences in pitting too early or too late, simulating possible traffic outcomes.
in the end, i could easily change some variables in some cells (excel) and see how much influence it took.

to keep people from wasting time, watching the replays in order to find out, i might as well tell it here:
my 2 stop strategy has been somewhat balanced to 8/9/12 for 29 lap races.
so, for a 33 lap race, it's easy to adjust, +1/+1/+2 = 9/10/14 stints.
else: round(8*laps/29), r(9*laps/29), r(12*laps/29).

for 1 stopper, i actually dont remember the exact percentage, but 40/60 has been somewhat close to it and is easy to remember and calculate.
according to a 33 lap race: 33/10*4=13.2, so: 13/20 stints.

alfonso pitted in lap 16. 3 laps of high damage + high fuel turtling around, where he lost to lanz 3 times over a second.
quite cruical! at some point the car feels like it starts to kinda exponentially slowing down in laptimes (instead of 0.05s/lap slower, laptimes increase by 0.1-0.15s/lap or so, for example).

next track, 47 laps, i already did 2 race simulations:
47/10*4=18.8, so 19/28 1 stopper and..
(8/9/12) * (47/29) =(13/15/19).

i accidently did a 14/15/18 though. whatsoever, both times i went under tijnys winning race total time from last season, both times i made mistakes of ~2.7seconds. but the 2 stopper was unfortunately 1.2s faster. unfortunately i say in this case, because a part of me hopes that people like stylus, alfonso and whip use 1 stoppers, in case lanz makes a 2 stopper, in order to hold him up a bit :P ;D..so he has to overtake them in last 3rd stint, by driving in av ~0.4s/lap faster. unfortunately it might be tough to not let him overtake, since in at least 1 part of the track it might be quite tough to defend.

2 race sims arent necessarily enough testing yet though. so, i will do at least 2 more in order to find out whats best in nurburgring for me.
i have to say though, that ive done quite well in entering and leaving the pits, as well as slowing down to pits and leaving with 100% energy as soon as possible. so, people who arent so good in pitting and might lose a lot of time there sometimes, should definately consider the 1 stopper.
also, people who lose a lot of time in overtaking, might prefer to consider a 1 stopper.
as far as i remember, 2 stoppers have more traffic problems than 1 stoppers.

1 stoppers drive a slow and constant race, only 1 major speed change due to the pitstop = less mistakes. easy to remember, when to pit, less of a problem if stopping 1 lap too early or too late.
2 stoppers change the speed of the car twice, so the braking points get different more often = more mistakes. but they have more room for strategy in order to overtake people.

let's say you have a really bad qualification, for lanz in nurburgring not getting into top3 or 4 might be quite bad.
let's say he is stuck behind alfonso, stylus and or palo in front and has a better pace, but is too slow to overtake.
in order to not get hold up so many 0.x sec/lap till the car in front pits, he might as well certainly consider to pit quite early and go for a 2 stopper, 13/15/19, maybe even something like 12/15/20 or even 11/15/21 and might as well pit earlier in the 2nd stint as well in order to overtake another tough to overtake opponent.

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Lanz
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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:54 pm

hehe! seems mike tries everything to win the PTM, even showing his secrets! :roll: well in fact i like that a lot, good for the competition! sadly that you missed 2 races in the beginning! on released tracks i`m definately a bit behind you but not that much! not sure how it would end with the same amount of training! don`t know how you were prepared for the other races cos yesterdays race was the first time you beated me on the track, apart from Show Event where i lost to Palo and for sure in the end to you as well!
about the strategy etc.:
i never fully focused on calculating the "perfect" strategy! the thing that helped me the most was experience! i remember failing a lot in f1sl and other cups as well in the beginning! the thing i can propose is to watch the races from last year! in 2 mins you find out what strategy won last year! ofc it`s 1-2 or a 3 stopper! :wink: this year i never had a master plan for a race, actually last year neither! i always check first how the race runs and i try to adapt later! like yesterday, after failing badly i didn`t decided to pit very early cos that can cost you a lot as well! pitting in lap 8 maybe gets you stucked in traffic, you just never know! but maybe you have free air and you put out some fast laps which isn`t easy either! you pass the guy in front you wanted to overtake with pitting early, still you have to defend on more worn tyres! i think i pitted in lap 10! but that what gave me the 2nd place in the end wasn`t the perfect strategy it was the speed i had! i think it`s more the feeling you develop over the years what gives you the right illumination in the right moment of what can help you the most or not! still it`s not bad to have a good plan ready, which in the end isn`t that hard in the PTM i think!

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:52 pm


power79
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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by power79 » Fri May 02, 2014 5:09 pm

I created some AI lines from last year's best Q1 and Q2 laps. AI drives them mostly in 25.1-25.3 range but at their best they can get under 25.

AI_Lines

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Afinfas » Fri May 02, 2014 5:12 pm

power79 wrote:I created some AI lines from last year's best Q1 and Q2 laps. AI drives them mostly in 25.1-25.3 range but at their best they can get under 25.

AI_Lines
Thanks! ;)

I also did some and my maximum was 25.05, so im sure Mike, Stylus and Lanz will go to 24.8 or similar! :)

I think I will mix the 2 AI lines...
"Dont forget to be happy!"

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Afinfas » Sun May 04, 2014 6:58 pm

So, quick review:

Got surprising pole.

On race made 3 pits and it showed up that wasnt a good option. Dont like to make excuses but this new guy called something like delacroix fckme up 3 times!!! One of them made me go completely to grass and loose something like 4s!!!! Took my mood completely out!
I realy like this track and I think is really a competitive one but unfortunately only made 5th place. Once again if it wasnt this §%&§$ I would at least reached the 4th place from Shzimek.

Congrats to Lanz for winning but mainly for organizing this! ;)

Hope that this series survives for at least one more season PTM3!

See you around guys and I sincerely hope that next time I play this is already on the new version. I remembered asking last year if until end of summer we would have new version out. Expectations were positive but...almost one year is gone and no signs of the new version at all! :(

ps: Secure a best position ever on a championship being 4th place! Also got a pole with Mike Nike and Lanz on track...quite an achievement I would say! 8)
"Dont forget to be happy!"

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Whiplash » Sun May 04, 2014 7:04 pm

Blah, worst race in the competition. DeMonix (or whatever his nick is) + warppy server killed my fun. Anyway, that will not ruin overall grade for this Tournament. With some small improvements it will getting better and better. So, congrats Lanz for the whole competition and for the last win.
I believe I slowed Mike a bit in last laps. I couldn't show up in a worst place after the second pit stop and some struggling with DeMonix. I couldn't fight with Mike because I was lapped - and I couldn't watch him in front of me because I had faster car. That was perfect situation for power79 and Lanz. :wink:
Anyway, videos are uploaded (first post).

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Sun May 04, 2014 7:28 pm

yeah i had already in my mind to ban that idjit before we start the race, sry guys was my bad! i also had problems with him!
despite not many guys showed up i think in the end it was good that i hosted this competition! i have not really some time left and those weeks were a bit more busy then the other ones, still i think it was worth it! thx to all who joined! special thx to whip for preparing server etc! maybe we see a PTM 3! can't promise anything but never say never! :wink:

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Mike Nike » Mon May 05, 2014 3:58 am

the cup:
although last race was once again another somewhat good example, why i dont like nonghost racing that much, participating at PTM is still better than not ;)
in so far, thx Lanz for hosting and all the work around! a lot of solid fast administration, setting up the server, continuing with next cupstages etc.
missing first 2 races, warps and disconnections (not just on my side) kinda made the season split to a bunch of single events instead of being one big event - to me.

the race:
worst warps to me in the season - but that was probably not the server, since i had those probs since a few days already.
even local driving was a hell of a challenge sometimes. big thx to the AI line creator, i tried ghostrace 47 laps 4/5 skill 20 cars, messed up place 12 (19min 52ish) in last lap and got 14th, with somewhat last startplace. quite a good practice to handle ghostirritation. once there were 6 cars within 0.0x or 0.1x sec, very close together, here and there 4 cars overlapping.
20 cars nonfuel was a warpdesaster though. quite good to practice online nonghost warpraces lol.
so, after a short night sleep (due to me trying to save someones life, including a motobike 30min 1-player sprint race against my opponents called police, traffic lights and unexpected blocked roads i had to drive around..lol, what sounds like an action movie was actually quite harmless), i did a 20min36 nonfuel race sim, 1 stopper, before the breakfast. still tired eyes, kinda slowish driven i thought, but nearly no mistakes. 20min37 and 20min36 i drove few days ago already in 2 sims.
the events race was 20min44 with lanz having a bad 1st pit and demoix or so holding him up around 1.3sec (plus the time he might have lost due to being in pressure in front of me, maybe). still, kinda slow race. considering the warps i had, it was probably still a somewhat okayish race (couple times left lower part i gone rly wide, which made me start driving this curve kinda blind in order to not go wide, since i realized i constantly get a warpstreak there at the same time for some reason - probably gfx ressources thingy).
warmup was okayish, q1 quite good. although local i was driving 47 laps 25.2x in average in a row with driving in +-80% under 25.1 as best out of 4 hotlaps. and 100% under 25.2 as best out of 4 hotlaps. so, q2 driving over 25.2x was probably a result of having just 3 laps practice of hotlaps before the race.
still, alfonso in the lead AND hoping he would stop 19/28 as i told him, even being behind lanz, i felt better than if it would be me 1st, lanz 2nd, 3rd alfonso. but oO wtf alfonso, 3 stops??? and stylus missing? oh dear :D
1st lap im behind lanz and heavily avoided to crash into him, when he steered into the curve later than i expected, made me almost lose a position. short later i slightly bumped palo and overtook him later on the straight. that was probably a scene id normally say, i should have given back the position. i havent rly checked the replay that well yet. sry either way, palo. i might deserve a punish at that part.
short later i might have been a bit bumped by alfonso in 1-2 spots i was surprised he did that, but..cant say for sure right now.
just like lanz, i was about to suggest to exclude demoix from the race, since he semi-messed up 1 of my q2 laps by driving around and not staying calm in pits. but the newblover in me somehow preferred to support the community in this case, so he was and is still welcome, if you ask me.
i even checked lanz race and saw that he beefed him offroad twice and didnt wait for him to overtake him again. that woulda certainly cost lanz 2 places though :P...
in this case, i dont blame lanz though and if any rules i currently dont know of (i didnt check the policy of this cup about letting pass beefed lapped cars who hold you up), would normally punish him here, i would vote against it, if that would influence anything.
having no clue if lanz is 2nd or worse during the race, i was fine just keeping to somewhat save the race victory and i actually didnt have serious doubts that i would still give it away. warps since lap 24 were getting kinda sick though until lap 40 or so, so i had quite a big challenge, more than the tough one i already had with the already frequent medium warps. then whip, lapped, came behind me and we both cost us some 0.x sec/lap, i think. weird situation. i couldnt just slow down let him pass, since that would mean lanz will catch me. but whip also kinda slowed me down slightly. my hope was, whip keeps a somewhat distance to me and only overtakes on a long straight if i made a mistake before. and if not, then at least somewhat ignores the blue flag to lanz "as well" (although trying to unlap is probably not equal to ignoring a blue flag, but you get my point, i think) by playing the sandwich and cost him some time too. unfortunately the worst case happen and he lets lanz pass easily, as if they were in the same team :P
while driving in front of whip i was wondering if it makes sense to sandwich-slow-down lanz to 3rd place somehow, but the distance to place 3 seemed too big. well, that cost another important 0.x sec+, in this case probably unnecessary.
2-3 laps defending vs a faster car on that track, quite hard i thought, so i immediately tried a risky curve and ended up failing bigtime by driving 1st time out of >200 laps in the sand in last curve...instead of playing it safe and hoping i can defend on the inside of the track. at that point 1st or 2nd didnt matter much.
i could have driven with more sharpness in q2, but i felt a bit careless somehow.
also in race i made 1 mistake in curve 1, a 0.7sec slowdown. the rest of the day was still quite solid, so i cant really blame me. with the slow race totaltime and the huge distance to place 3, it seems, there was probably never a real danger for lanz though to give away place 1 in the championship.

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Mon May 05, 2014 8:17 am

Mike Nike wrote:just like lanz, i was about to suggest to exclude demoix from the race, since he semi-messed up 1 of my q2 laps by driving around and not staying calm in pits. but the newblover in me somehow preferred to support the community in this case, so he was and is still welcome, if you ask me.
i even checked lanz race and saw that he beefed him offroad twice and didnt wait for him to overtake him again. that woulda certainly cost lanz 2 places though :P...
in this case, i dont blame lanz though and if any rules i currently dont know of (i didnt check the policy of this cup about letting pass beefed lapped cars who hold you up), would normally punish him here, i would vote against it, if that would influence anything.

well after he cost me my nice gap i had to you in the beginning of the race he was an outlaw to me! :wink:

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Mon May 05, 2014 8:18 pm

Results:


Nürburgring


Q1:

1. [Merc] Mike Nike (25.063)
2. [BMW] Lanz (25.237)
3. [Audi] Palo (25.261)
4. [Merc] Alfonso (25.282)
5. [BMW] Szymek (25.441)
==========================
6. [Merc] Whiplash (25.477)
7. [BMW] power79 (25.754)
8. [Audi] DeMOiX (27.515)
9. [Merc] laf (26.202)
10. [Merc] CLUB (25.969)
11. [Merc] kyna's (no Time)


Q2:

1. [Merc] Alfonso (25.110)
2. [BMW] Lanz (25.214)
3. [Merc] Mike Nike (25.264)
4. [Audi] Palo (25.371)
5. [BMW] Szymek (25.404)
==========================
6. [Merc] Whiplash (25.477)
7. [BMW] power79 (25.754)
8. [Audi] DeMOiX (27.515)
9. [Merc] laf (26.202)
10. [Merc] CLUB (25.969) back of the Grid penalty for driving in Q2
11. [Merc] kyna's (no Time)


Race:

1. [BMW] Lanz 20:44.127 - Lap 18 32 (25.444)
2. [Merc] Mike Nike +1.665 - Lap 22 (25.529)
3. [Audi] Palo +9.055 - Lap 34 (25.296)
4. [BMW] Szymek +12.667 - Lap 32 (25.435)
5. [Merc] Alfonso +14.956 - Lap 41 (25.394)
6. [BMW] power79 +24.659 - Lap 32 (25.821)
7. [Merc] Whiplash +1 Lap - Lap 31 (25.849)
8. [Merc] kyna's +2 Laps - Lap 38 (25.691)
9. [Merc] laf +2 Laps - Lap 15 (26.070)
10. [Audi] DeMOiX +6 Laps - Lap 25 (27.333)
11. [Merc] CLUB +19 Laps - Lap 15 (25.974)


EDIT: due to the bad behaviour on Track DeMOiX`s 1 point for finishing 10th will not be awarded!

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Re: PTM 2 - Infos - Schedule - Subscriptions

Post by Lanz » Wed May 07, 2014 8:28 pm


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