Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Talk it up about competitions, cups, races, and tournaments.

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Tijny
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Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Thu Dec 04, 2014 2:38 pm

I'm sure most of you have seen the server. Every week, a set of cars and track(s) is randomly selected (usually the cars will be default ones), and people have a week to drive their best laps.

For now, the results can be found here until I've made something a bit more fancy:
Results!

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Thu Dec 04, 2014 3:12 pm

Tijny wrote:(usually the cars will be default ones)
Don't even dare to experiment there something!

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Mike Nike
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Mike Nike » Thu Dec 04, 2014 4:18 pm

Haha Whip :)
Tijny can experiment as much as he wants as long as there is a 24/7 hotlap competition going on and the group of anonymous lapwankers can have their daily dose :D

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Chukie » Fri Dec 05, 2014 7:41 am

Hey Tijny,

Are you planning on building an archive for the hot laps? Would be great to check a bit further back how I'm doing. Thanks for this already though!

Also, please stick to default cars on this server? Default cars servers are already sparse and with the touring car server gone there's almost only AntiSlider and F1 servers available. At least for me the hot lap server (and the occasional Slide Shack) are the only public dedicated servers that interest me.
"We play more games before 9am than most people play all day."

Tijny
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:12 am

Yes, I am planning on building an archive, some ranking systems, and the lord knows what else.. when I make some time and motivation for it. But everything is saved into the database already, so these results will count when that day comes.

About the cars... we'll see. For now there are no custom cars that I would like to use in this competition, so it will be all default for a while at least. (well, there might be one, but whip would kill me.)

Tijny
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Sat Dec 06, 2014 10:35 am

Just a reminder, this competition ends at just after 16:00 UTC+1; a new track will be randomly chosen after that. Seems I have work to do if I want to beat Mike. :(

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by CrazybikE » Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:39 am

playing from a week and trying to follow the best of yours when i'm on server...still i am 0.7-1.0 seconds slower :lol: :lol: :lol:

i have to do too much training :mrgreen:

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Hevonen
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Hevonen » Wed Dec 10, 2014 11:47 am

Formula wank with 3 tracks could be nice too from time to time.

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:59 pm

Hevonen wrote:Formula wank with 3 tracks could be nice too from time to time.
Not on this server, baby!

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:05 pm

Hevonen wrote:Formula wank with 3 tracks could be nice too from time to time.
Sure, that will happen at some point in the future.

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:21 pm

Tijny wrote:
Hevonen wrote:Formula wank with 3 tracks could be nice too from time to time.
Sure, that will happen at some point in the future.
F***!

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Mike Nike
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Mike Nike » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:45 pm

stats overview
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/hotlapweekly/

or short:

week1:
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/h ... _12_06.htm

week2:
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/h ... _11_29.htm

@tijny
if you include the included features some day, it would be cool :)
else, i just keep on working it out manually so long..

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:09 pm

Heu! I like it a lot! Especially the overall table on the right side of the page (I hardly noticed it though :wink: ). It's nicely colorful.
Colors for bronze and silver should just be changed. Bronze is too dark.
It would be the best to set silver color to be bronze, and then pick some lighter gray color for silver.

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iBlaze²
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by iBlaze² » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:42 pm

Mike Nike wrote:stats overview
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/hotlapweekly/

or short:

week1:
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/h ... _12_06.htm

week2:
http://mikenike.pf-control.de/ts/cups/h ... _11_29.htm

@tijny
if you include the included features some day, it would be cool :)
else, i just keep on working it out manually so long..
Really nice Mike. Love the table at the right side showing how many of each position each player got.

Just one small thing - the links in your post are the wrong way round, so week 1 currently links to week 2's sheet and vice versa.
Whiplash wrote:Colors for bronze and silver should just be changed. Bronze is too dark.
It would be the best to set silver color to be bronze, and then pick some lighter gray color for silver.
And I don't agree with this at all. I like the colours how they are. Bronze is not silver Whip :?:

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:07 pm

iBlaze² wrote:And I don't agree with this at all. I like the colours how they are. Bronze is not silver Whip :?:
Well, I'll say it like this:
Both, silver and bronze, are too dark. They both just need to be lighter. That's all.

And that overall table should be on left side. I guess it can be done by cut/paste.

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by power79 » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:02 am

And if someone could post recordings of fast(est) laps from the server so that we slower drivers could get some tips for our driving. Of course recordings from current competition would be more useful than past competitions.

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:04 pm

Mike, another suggestion:
You should sort players by Av column, not by Max. So, Av column should be placed on first position in front of Max.
Also, Av values aren't counted well now. If some player has no time with some car, that time should be counted as 0. Then his Av will be much lower, which is expected. Now if somebody has a good time with one car, his Av is counted just as that time - which is bad.

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Mike Nike
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Mike Nike » Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:12 pm

i probably liked the tendence of good players being high in the list.
so janne wouldn't appear far down, just because he only drove with easyslider.

anyway, we are kind of an unactive community in relation to how awesome this game actually is ;P (oh well, imo)...
so, at the moment i prefer to make/keep people being active in the servers...
so as much as i like many kind of rankings, i dont want to ruin any activiness by giving certain stats more "value".
this said, i actually should rank janne accordingly low. so people driving a lot, will be ranked higher..
and: no matter how skilled tijny is, driving laprecords in just 1-3 stints or so, crazy marathon lapwankers, like me and...well, probably palo for that .480 record in week 2, deserve some credit for reaching the best lap, even tijny woulda likely reached it as well (and with less attempts/stints).

@tijny
as you can see, i love these stats, who actually show skill and potential of drivers, so...amount of driven laps per car per week might be a great add to some fancy stats, but during a time where activiness feels more important, joining the server more often should probably be valued more than usual.

@all
hmm, how about hotlapcups (for an evening) with just 1 car instead of 5 defaults? and most usually just 1 track, but more is fine too.

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:36 pm

Mike Nike wrote:i probably liked the tendence of good players being high in the list.
so janne wouldn't appear far down, just because he only drove with easyslider.
Yeah, maybe that's not that bad logic in the end either.

Mike Nike wrote:amount of driven laps per car per week might be a great add to some fancy stats, but during a time where activiness feels more important, joining the server more often should probably be valued more than usual.
I'm against that info actually. I believe that even if you value high activity as something "good", we will always know that it's actually a bad sign of a player's skill rating. So, players could resist joining the server more often when knowing that each of their stints will be counted and showed as an info. Let's not get in the situation where people will wank off-line and then join the server to hit a good lap in a short amount of time. :wink:

Mike Nike wrote:hmm, how about hotlapcups (for an evening) with just 1 car instead of 5 defaults? and most usually just 1 track, but more is fine too.
I thought some time ago that T could make an automatic IHLC/IRT cup on the end of each week:
- 5 races, 12 laps
- 5 different cars
- 1 track (the one that is just wanked that last week)

After this kind of cup, autoserver would set new track for new HL week.

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Whiplash
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Whiplash » Thu Dec 18, 2014 1:24 am

HERE you can download top times for all of the cars. I didn't get Mike's AntiSlider time cause Tijny's ranking shows wrong date of it. Ranking says "16 Dec '14", but it was obviously done a day earlier/later. Same goes with Tijny's Spinner video. I was bored to search them again. So, you have there T's AntiSlider video, and Mike's Spinner video.

Anyway, I think in the end that these videos shouldn't be released on this way. We should show them only after the week is over in order to respect the records owners.
It's better to see people trying different lines and driving different styles instead of just trying to copy others'.

Tijny
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Thu Dec 18, 2014 9:42 am

Mike's AntiSlider lap was done on a day boundary, so the video's date shows December 15, but the script for that race executed on December 16. Seems I have to use the time the race started in my script, instead of the current time.

My Spinner lap is still in /video/autosave, because I haven't automated the shit yet.

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Ender » Fri Dec 19, 2014 12:51 pm

It's good to see best laptimes, maybe I can improve my own best time...... :P
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Tijny
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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Tue Dec 23, 2014 10:56 am

Yesterday, I wrote a script to generate an image of a car's driving line and speed at various moments, using the data from output.txt in -debug 3 mode. Then, I made an analysis of Badeend's fastest AntiSlider lap compared to my own; I found the results to be pretty interesting.

Sc_bonneville, AntiSlider - 26.786 ([+] Tinjovic)
Sc_bonneville, AntiSlider - 26.916 ([+] Badeend)

White numbers are time marks, the colored numbers are the car's speed at that point. All the peak speeds are displayed.

Looking at the first corner, it's clear that Badeend is faster there, carrying more speed through the corner, accelerating earlier and driving closer to the inside, probably gaining over 0.050 seconds there. The second corner I thought was pretty interesting - B's lowest speed was significantly slower than mine, but he also started accelerating earlier again, and even arrives at the next corner with a higher speed (194 vs. 192), maintaining his advantage.

Turn 3 is in my favor, as Badeend only accelerates at the apex, whereas I hit the throttle before it. In the next two corners, B's lead turns into a deficit, as he went into the section with less speed, going slightly wide in one corner and hitting the grass ever so slightly in the next, and before the next sharp turn, the difference is around 0.050 in my favor, I would say.

Speaking of the sharp turn, that's where it gets really interesting. Looking at Badeend's speeds there, he appears to have gone through the corner much faster than I did, but he slowed down from 134 to 122 after the apex, whereas that is the moment you want to slam the accelerator. Comparing this to my line, I slowed down from 200+ to 108 in one go, then accelerated from the corner in a tidy fashion. If I were to make the speeds through this corner into a graph, Badeend's would look like a 'W', and mine would look like a 'V', and a 'V' is almost always what you want. The difference seems to be around 0.080 seconds at the hairpin that follows.

In the easy bend on the next straight, I hit the grass ever so slightly, causing my speed to drop and allowing Badeend to catch up a bit. In the fast lower right corner however, he didn't drive quite as closely to the edge as I did, having to lift as a consequence. The higher speed I carried onto the second-to-last straight was the final blow, even if B appears to have nibbled back a few hundredths of a second in the last corner.

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by power79 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 3:35 pm

Nice analysis Tijny, felt like MikeNike's stuff but this was somehow easier to read. :lol:

I think I have aimed mostly similar driving line but i used other side of the road at the bottom straight. It felt like it was easier to get "turning momentum" (like a pendulum effect, lol) and make the next corner with full throttle, but probably not the case. Plus of course my lines and acceleration points never hit that well and Im always something like 2%-3% slower than top drivers.

Btw is it optimal to use break with antislider at this track on some points? I really can't control that sliding effect that comes with braking so I always just lift throttle instead.

I thought this same analysis could have been made using your TSRWorkshop program but according to Whiplash it seems broken. Maybe there are just some small changes required for new version to make it work again? I thought of making similar program myself as Whiplash requested but when I started planning, it felt like too much work, specially if your version could be fixed with small effort.

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Re: Weekly Hot Lap Competition

Post by Tijny » Tue Dec 23, 2014 4:20 pm

I only brake in the first part of the slow corner combination in the lower left part of the track. Badeend apparently braked in the first and last corners as well, and even though he pulled that off nicely in his best lap, I'm a bit skeptical about whether it's really faster. About losing control, I find it's easier to control the slide if you release the throttle for just a bit before braking.

About my old TSR merger program, I haven't really looked into fixing it, and I'm not sure I'd want to. It's really awful code, written when I was ignorant of any of C++'s idioms and best practices, full of memory leaks and the like.... I have started writing a new version, but I'm not sure when that is ready for use.

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